Turkish Stones

cotedupy

Guru
@cotedupy I need to eat my words....

I took the razor back to the stone for an extra 100 zero pressure passes and today I had a very close and comfortable shave.....and I think I can still improve it! (aren't novaculites slow?)

Big shout out to Oli, this stone will now come down from the shelf to live on the bench. :thumbsup:
Ah, this is very interesting! TBH a lot of what I said above was more in relation to knives than it was razors, though the same kind of principles should apply. Some of my old Turkish in particular seem a little bit too inconsistent for good razor finishing, but a couple would work well I think, so you've inspired me to give a proper whirl later. And your stone does certainly look very consistent, with none of the rougher lines running along the length, so is exactly the kind of Cretan I would have thought to be a good razor candidate. It really does look like a gem that stone :).

As you've noticed to get something like this to work well as a razor finisher, requires a bit of manipulation. Turkish/Cretan stones are actually incredibly fast for how fine they are, so you do need to try use them as slowly as possible to get them to finishing level. Super light passes, trying to burnish the surface a bit &c.

The same actually applies to stuff like translucent arks - if you rough the surface at 140 grit or something they'll cut amazingly quickly... for about 90 seconds. But if you take up to 800 and then burnish the surface with a knife or chisel, they effectively pretty much stop cutting metal, and work insanely finely and slowly.
 

MichaelS

Forum GOD!
Ah, this is very interesting! TBH a lot of what I said above was more in relation to knives than it was razors, though the same kind of principles should apply. Some of my old Turkish in particular seem a little bit too inconsistent for good razor finishing, but a couple would work well I think, so you've inspired me to give a proper whirl later. And your stone does certainly look very consistent, with none of the rougher lines running along the length, so is exactly the kind of Cretan I would have thought to be a good razor candidate. It really does look like a gem that stone :).

As you've noticed to get something like this to work well as a razor finisher, requires a bit of manipulation. Turkish/Cretan stones are actually incredibly fast for how fine they are, so you do need to try use them as slowly as possible to get them to finishing level. Super light passes, trying to burnish the surface a bit &c.

The same actually applies to stuff like translucent arks - if you rough the surface at 140 grit or something they'll cut amazingly quickly... for about 90 seconds. But if you take up to 800 and then burnish the surface with a knife or chisel, they effectively pretty much stop cutting metal, and work insanely finely and slowly.
Indeed I'm a strong believer in burnishing, the translucent arks get the chisel treatment. I need 200 passes after that with razors but the stellar result is worth waiting for! My Turkish was probably a bit burnished previously from light use with kitchen knives. I guess it will improve with use too.
 

cotedupy

Guru
Indeed I'm a strong believer in burnishing, the translucent arks get the chisel treatment. I need 200 passes after that with razors but the stellar result is worth waiting for! My Turkish was probably a bit burnished previously from light use with kitchen knives. I guess it will improve with use too.
I'm with you - I quite like burnishing an ark for razors. More difficult to do with a Cretan because of their friability, but I think your little experiment has shown that it's perfectly possible, if using very light pressure so as not to expose new material in the stone :).

Another way I've heard to get this effect is: instead of soaking the stone in oil at the start, to put it in a low oven with a lump of wax on top and let that melt into the stone. Which apparently really slows it down and pushes the fineness up.
 

MichaelS

Forum GOD!
Will try with the wax thing, how interesting!

I heard a related technique recently concerning coticules (which I have not yet tried): hone on a dry coticule; at the end of the session lightly brush off the accumulated metal from the surface with a cloth but do not wash or hard scrub the coticule surface to get it completely clean. The ingrained metal dust remaining on the coticule surface is supposed to smoothen and increase the stone's finenes and it gets better and better with use....

True or mumbo-jumbo? There's only one way to find out! :)
 
Hi,
Realize this is an old discussion, but I'm new to the forum, and joined after reading this discussion. I learned quite a bit reading the well researched information provided by cotedupy. I was interested in the "turkey stone", but thought it was just lost to history. I did some digging after learning from this discussion that the historic "turkey stone" was from Crete. Not sure if the following citation has been added anywhere on this forum before or anywhere else for that matter, so wanted to post it in case it hasn't been.

“The town of Candia may be communicated with from here in ten hours, and some supplies may be obtained from the interior, but none at Spinalonga where the produce is only salt and whetstones, for which it has always been noted, the true Turkey stone coming from here.”

Thomas Abel B. Spratt, Sailing directions for the island of Candia or Crete (London: 1866), 16.

As an admiral and geologist Thomas Spratt would seem to be a reliable source of contemporary information when the use of the "turkey stone" was at it's most widespread. Hope this information helps.
TC
 

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cotedupy

Guru
Hi,
Realize this is an old discussion, but I'm new to the forum, and joined after reading this discussion. I learned quite a bit reading the well researched information provided by cotedupy. I was interested in the "turkey stone", but thought it was just lost to history. I did some digging after learning from this discussion that the historic "turkey stone" was from Crete. Not sure if the following citation has been added anywhere on this forum before or anywhere else for that matter, so wanted to post it in case it hasn't been.

“The town of Candia may be communicated with from here in ten hours, and some supplies may be obtained from the interior, but none at Spinalonga where the produce is only salt and whetstones, for which it has always been noted, the true Turkey stone coming from here.”

Thomas Abel B. Spratt, Sailing directions for the island of Candia or Crete (London: 1866), 16.

As an admiral and geologist Thomas Spratt would seem to be a reliable source of contemporary information when the use of the "turkey stone" was at it's most widespread. Hope this information helps.
TC


I haven't logged into these forums for a little while, but more fool me!

You're correct - that citation hasn't been noted before by myself, or anybody else afaik. I've spent a probably quite silly amount of time trying to find a contemporary c.19th source directly linking Crete to the Turkish Oilstone... and there it is! Moreover it actually specifies Spinalonga / Elounda as the source, which is obviously where modern Cretan stones are from.

Kudos for some absolutely first rate research, and thank you for sharing. It is (at last) the final chapter in: 'The Turkish Oilstone Matter'.
 
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